Judeo-Christian Ideals/Understanding/Beliefs

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Section Contains arguments that: talk about what do Christians believe, should do, and way of life.

+ Crusades and witches burning

Does Jesus (thus Christianity) endorse the Witch Burning Trials?

< No. Jesus said love your enemies (Mat 5:44). (Biblical)

Also, Jesus forced out demons and dinned with the sinners no matter how bad. (Mat 11:19, Mat 9:33).

Also, Jesus killed not one person.

 

Spirit led people (witches) are enemies and demon led.

Therefore, we are to love them and force demons outside of them.

Therefore, the people who burned witches were not following Jesus and were wrong.

 

Can the OT Laws (where it said to kill them) defend the Witch Trials killings?

< No. Things were different then.

Anyone who were terrible sinners or did some wrong small thing (like break the Sabbath) were to be killed before Jesus came.

But during Jesus' time, he was friends with them. So should Christians be friends nowadays.

 

Should Christians self-defense from witches?

< Very likely. Of course when Christians are threatened to death, they have to protect themselves.  (Biblical)

Jesus didn’t command his followers to turn the other cheek if someone stabbed him on the other side.

·         Mat 5:39  But I tell you not to try to get even with a person who has done something to you. When someone slaps your right cheek, turn and let that person slap your other cheek.

 

Nonetheless, we’re not clear what did Jesus say about self defense.

 

+ Christianity and Government

Should Christians denounce the rebellion of USA to England?

< No, especially since it’s a trap.

Since it would force Christians to denounce the Christian decision of the US Founders to rebel. 

 

Was the primary historical force which resulted in the Independence of the U.S. the ENLIGHTENMENT?

(a response and refutation of the Biblical notion of DIVINE RIGHT of Kings (or any rulers))

 

< ?

 

 

How should Christians be towards to non-immoral laws?

< STRONG Good and respectable.  

Civil laws are taxes, road rules, and governmental proceedings.

 

Mat 22:21  They said, "Caesar's." Then he said to them, "Therefore render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's."

 

Whenever they don’t interfere, we are commanded to obey government’s law.

 

 

NEED: somehow to include details of the question.

-should not interfere with response formats.

-define terms

 

 

When immoral laws are enforced, what should Christians do?

>> STRONG Not rebel, since it is disobedient of Divine Right of Kings.

Romans13:1-2 "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ORDAINED of God. Whoever therefore resists the power, resists the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation."

 

< STRONG Paul is simply talking about obeying CIVIL laws and not IMMORAL laws.


Rom 13:3 For rulers are not a TERROR to GOOD conduct, but to bad. Would you have no fear of the one who is in authority? Then do what is GOOD, and you will receive his approval,

Rom 13:4 for he is God's servant for your good.

 

< STRONG Maybe rebel, since Christians should Obey God not man.

This is whenever man makes immoral laws that infringe God’s moral laws.


Act 5:29  But Peter and the apostles answered, "We must obey God rather than men.

 

Mat 22:21  They said, "Caesar's." Then he said to them, "Therefore render to Caesar the things that are Caesar's, and to God the things that are God's."

 

Here, it can be implied that whenever Caesar’s laws conflict with God’s laws, you can’t give to Caesar what belongs to God.

< Ignore the laws and get punished.

That’s what the early Christians did.  

 

~ Should Christians denounce the Revolutionary War or any other war if the US was a Christian nation? 

< SAME QUEST AS: Should Christians rebel?

 

 

Does God like kings to rule other than himself?

< STRONG No. He disliked kings but was OK with it. (Biblical)

1Sa 8:6 Samuel was upset to hear the leaders say they wanted a king, so he prayed about it.
...
1Sa 8:10 Samuel told the people who were asking for a king what the LORD had said:
1Sa 8:11 If you have a king, this is how he will treat you. He will force your sons to join his army. Some of them will ride in his chariots, some will serve in the cavalry, and others will run ahead of his own chariot.

 

But there did exist leaders and judges at that time, so there was some governing. But a king was something much different than merely just appointed leaders.

 

 

What would be an Ideal Christian Government for the Nations?

< ?

< Possbily this framework:

1) king should be a genuine family line
2) if king is an idiot, there is a riot
3) king is responsible for teaching his children best values as possible, if children don't comply, election is executed
4) if king dies before child is mature, election
5) public should be educated
6) education should be available, genuine, and flexible to all
 

 

 

+ Slavery in the Bible

Does the bible promote slavery?

Yes and no. It does allow slavery, but only the rightful use of slavery. It doesn’t promote the abuse of slaves and killing them like animals and property.

 

Also, citizens and races can’t be forced into slavery unless they were war prisoners or they sold themselves because they were poor and couldn’t afford anything. (

 

What are the OT slavery laws?

1.      Hebrew slaves only work for 6 years and on 7th they go free (Exo 21:2)

2.      Can't kidnap a person and sell him or make him into your slave

o   Punishment: death

3.      Can't kill any slave by beating him up

o   Punishment: death

4.      Can't beat up a slave

o   Punishment: if slave gets well afterwards, it will only cost the master 

5.      if a tooth or eye or whatever is destroyed, then slave goes free

6.      if a bull kills someone, even a slave, then the bill must be destroyed

 

 

 

+ Speaking for Oneself, instead of God

Did Paul ever say things on his own accord?

< No. For some things, Paul explicitly spoke for himself, not God.

 Which means that he separates his opinions from God's commands:

1Co 7:6  In my opinion that is what should be done, though I don't know of anything the Lord said about this matter.

 

 

Are there Different Levels of Judgment?

< Yes, it especially so with Teachers of the Law (Biblical)

Luk 20:46  "Beware of the scribes, who like to walk around in long robes, and love greetings in the marketplaces and the best seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at feasts,

Luk 20:47  who devour widows' houses and for a pretense make long prayers. They will receive the greater condemnation."

 

< Yes. Lazarus went to Heaven because he had nothing and lived a bad life.

Luk 16:19  "There was a rich man who was clothed in purple and fine linen and who feasted sumptuously every day.

Luk 16:20  And at his gate was laid a poor man named Lazarus, covered with sores,

Luk 16:21  who desired to be fed with what fell from the rich man's table. Moreover, even the dogs came and licked his sores.

Luk 16:22  The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried,

Luk 16:23  and in Hades, being in torment, he lifted up his eyes and saw Abraham far off and Lazarus at his side.

 

 

Would People who Never heard about Jesus still go to Heaven?

< Maybe.

It’s possible that they might meet up with Jesus, and if they are good, they would accept Jesus to be cleansed of sin, which allows them to go be with Holy God. If they are bad, then they won’t accept Jesus, and therefore are thrown to hell.

 

Based on this premise, it puts these verses in proper perspective.

 

Luk 16:22  The poor man died and was carried by the angels to Abraham's side. The rich man also died and was buried,

 

Here, Lazarus didn’t explicitly hear the gospel yet he went to heaven. And there is no gospel environment in this parable, so he didn’t have that. He did have Moses and the Prophets, but since he was poor, it’s possible he never heard of it, esp with dogs licking his sores. So it’s possible that people who never had a chance can still get to heaven. Though we shouldn’t bet on it.

 

 

Luk 16:27  And he said, 'Then I beg you, father, to send him to my father's house--

Luk 16:28  for I have five brothers--so that he may warn them, lest they also come into this place of torment.'

Luk 16:29  But Abraham said, 'They have Moses and the Prophets; let them hear them.'

Luk 16:30  And he said, 'No, father Abraham, but if someone goes to them from the dead, they will repent.'

Luk 16:31  He said to him, 'If they do not hear Moses and the Prophets, neither will they be convinced if someone should rise from the dead.'"

 

Notice here that the Rich Man and his brothers could have avoided hell by looking at Moses and the Prophets. This seems true for ALL people who never heard about Jesus, but can get a second chance when they go to be judged.

 

Are there Different Levels of Awards in Heaven?

< Yes. We can work for treasure in Heaven instead of on Earth(Biblical)

 

Mat 6:19  "Do not lay up for yourselves treasures on earth, where moth and rust destroy and where thieves break in and steal,

Mat 6:20  but lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust destroys and where thieves do not break in and steal.

 

Mat 19:21  Jesus said to him, "If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow me."

 

What Does Jesus think of Flip Flopping on Positions based on circumstances?

< He hated them, since the priests didn’t answer the question honestly. (Biblical)

Luk 20:1  One day, as Jesus was teaching the people in the temple and preaching the gospel, the chief priests and the scribes with the elders came up

Luk 20:2  and said to him, "Tell us by what authority you do these things, or who it is that gave you this authority."

Luk 20:3  He answered them, "I also will ask you a question. Now tell me,

Luk 20:4  was the baptism of John from heaven or from man?"

Luk 20:5  And they discussed it with one another, saying, "If we say, 'From heaven,' he will say, 'Why did you not believe him?'

Luk 20:6  But if we say, 'From man,' all the people will stone us to death, for they are convinced that John was a prophet."

Luk 20:7  So they answered that they did not know where it came from.

Luk 20:8  And Jesus said to them, "Neither will I tell you by what authority I do these things."

 

< By example, he didn’t flip flop by refusing to say killer positions.

He said that He was the Son of God many times, which would get him killed. In fact, it is what actually got him killed with the crucifixion. But of course, He allowed Himself to get killed like that for our sins.

Is it Right to Circumcise Today as a Christian?

< No. Today’s practices are different from Jesus’ and Israel’s time.

Further, the circumcision of Jesus' time was quite different than the circumcision of today. Circumcision was merely a cutting of the tip of the extra tissue at the end of the foreskin, not the complete amputation of the entire foreskin. Most of the foreskin was retained, protecting the glans of the penis.

 

< Peter and others forbidded it.

Peter was confronted with the circumcision question, to which he referred to his dream.


Then he said:

 

Act 11:17  If then God gave the same gift to them as he gave to us when we believed in the Lord Jesus Christ, who was I that I could stand in God's way?"

 

Therefore, it looks like it’s true that the Gentiles shouldn’t be circumcised in this new era of the New Testament.

 

 

Jesus said that you shall have everlasting life, so how come all His believers died?

< Simple, Jesus believed in the Resurrection which serves as a bridge to everlasting life. (Biblical) 

All people will die, even Jesus died, but that’s what makes the Resurrection so important. We must die before we get resurrected.

 

Luk 20:35  but those who are considered worthy to attain to that age and to the resurrection from the dead neither marry nor are given in marriage,

Can People Be Satan Led?

< Yes. It's rather quite possible many are influenced by evil.

Since we can't see the spiritual realm, it's hard to prove wrong; just like it's quite hard to prove whether an RC toy car is being controlled by radio vs it controlling itself or both, if we didn't have a radio wave detector.

 

If you look at hatred and feelings associated, it's rather destructive, like an evil force. Like in the Witches Hammer (?), it was quite destructive. Those people committing mass murder were either miss-led and narrow minded, extremely hating, evil for power (Satan-led you might say), or a combination. They were definitely not doing it as true Christians.

 

If someone doesn’t deserve something of value, should you give it to them as a Christian?

< STRONG  Yes. Just as God made the sun rise for the evil, do good things to evil people.

Mat 5:45  Then you will be acting like your Father in heaven. He makes the sun rise on both good and bad people. And he sends rain for the ones who do right and for the ones who do wrong.

 

If someone doesn’t appreciate or care about something that will help them, should you give it to them as a Christian?

< STRONG No. Don’t give Pearls to Pigs.

Mat 7:6  Don't give to dogs what belongs to God. They will only turn and attack you. Don't throw pearls down in front of pigs. They will trample all over them.

 

I assume that pearls are things that people can’t handle or don’t appreciate although it should help them.

 

>> Ok  Yes, since they might later come to appreciate you and your care.

Just let them know that you’ve done it for them and that it will help them, then you’re off the hook of responsibility.

 

< VERY STRONG But you might be despised of telling people to do things where they think you’re wrong.

So just hold it to yourself and improve yourself. Ask people for help to show you appreciate their help. And if someone recognizes you and appreciates your advice, then you can tell them.

 

For example, sending out newsletters to people about health where they think you’re crazy and bothering them. Why bother?

 

>> WEAK Yes. Just as God made the sun rise for the evil, do good things to evil people.

Mat 5:45  Then you will be acting like your Father in heaven. He makes the sun rise on both good and bad people. And he sends rain for the ones who do right and for the ones who do wrong.

< STRONG But evil people might appreciate those things, that’s why it’s good being done to evil.

What Does Jesus mean by “Leaving Everything”?

< STRONG Maybe the command “to UTMATELY leave and follow Jesus” isn't for “everything”. (Biblical)

 

Luk 5:28  And leaving everything, he rose and followed him.

Luk 5:29  And Levi made him a great feast in his house, and there was a large company of tax collectors and others reclining at table with them.

 

If Levi left everything, then what about the money to afford the feast and his house?

 

Are Old Testament Laws still in effect?

< Yes (Biblical)

Mat 5:19  Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

We are saved by grace, not by works. But faith without works is dead. 

 

>> IF laws are still in effect, why don't we?

Circumcise?

 

 

What’s Significant about Resurrection?

< A lot.

·         About 50% of the prophesies are on Jesus resurrection: Isaiah and Jesus' teachings.

·         50% of everything Jesus teaches rely on his resurrection.

o   raises people to life to be judged

o   offers eternity

o   proves his deity

 

If Christians have different beliefs, should they split?

< No. (Biblical) 

1Co3.4 For when one says, "I follow Paul," and another, "I follow Apollos," are you not being merely human?

 

 

Why should Christians Evangelize?

Why are you so concerned about preaching or converting people?

< STRONG Because Jesus said so. (Biblical)

 

< Every one of us has something of high value.

It's intrinsic.

If you've taken philosophy, you'd know what it is.

We are not walking monkeys, we have something that all other animals don't have. That’s why everyone should know about God.

 

Does Bible Condone Women Submitting to Man?

< STRONG Not really. Jesus had nothing to do with repressing women. (Biblical)

He used Women as the first people to witness the Resurrection and to Evangelize about it.

 

< A little.  Paul condoned it in Corinthians.

When reading what Paul wrote, I thought that there must be some explanation behind it.

 

iLumina Gold on 1 Corinthians 14:34

Does this mean that women should not speak in church services today? It is clear from 11:5 that

women prayed and prophesied in public worship. It is also clear in chapters 12–14 that women are

given spiritual gifts and are encouraged to exercise them in the body of Christ. Women have much

to contribute and can participate in worship services.

In the Corinthian culture, women were not allowed to confront men in public. Apparently some of

the women who had become Christians thought that their Christian freedom gave them the right to

question the men in public worship. This was causing division in the church. In addition, women of

that day did not receive formal religious education as did the men. Women may have been raising

questions in the worship services that could have been answered at home without disrupting the

services. Paul was asking the women not to flaunt their Christian freedom during worship. The

purpose of Paul’s words was to promote unity, not to teach about women’s roles in the church.